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BusManagement
Anyone interested in organizing the bus, the routes, the bus stops and everything else, please join the Bus Management here on this page. You will be expected to cooperate, to leave your e-mail-address here (for urgent decisions) and follow the common decisions. Check here to see if there are tours you can drive or build: TourBusMap
The Bus Management will decide democratically on the routes and on all other issues of the TourBus.
Current member list of the BusManagement:
Anyone interested to contribute is invited to join. To join:
You might want to have a look at a wiki known as handgranat.org
After I returned from Europe and finally had a chance to look into the rapidly growing TourBus project, what I saw worried me. I was afraid that the BusManagement may conflict with my goals for MeatBall that I have worked on for the past three years. Most of this was probably due to misunderstanding the state of the TourBus pages at the time. This led to a large argument and falling out between myself and the TourBus people. That I am emphatically not proud of.
While I still feel that more aggressive user empowerment will be the only stable way forward, my goals for Meatball supersede those concerns. As Helmut was trying to point out, Meatball really is responsible to the larger wiki community - or at least I think it should be - and thus it (and I) must remain supportive - and besides, there are better BarnRaising ways of working on this. This is not to say that I now think Meatball should have power over the wiki community; rather that Meatball now serves it. We are here to help.
Conversely, the TourBus will empower Meatball by positioning it closer to the centre of the action and by enriching it with a wider experience. While previously I had chosen to keep MeatballWiki out of the way of other projects' distorting forces, I no longer feel that is necessary. MeatballWiki has matured to the point where it can begin to look outside itself, and thus it should.
This is a confusing mishmash of personal opinions, addresses to the community at large, and core community values. Think of this as a hint of where I want to go next, and I would be pleased if the rest of the community agrees. -- SunirShah
I think that the TourBus is bound to become a kind of institution. That means, as we go along, we will have the problem to restrict powers and to find a way for collective decisions. Some may think that this is "not the wiki way", but it may be inevitable. As the wiki grows and gains importance, we will cross the border of the "gaming zone" and come into an area where real interests are concerned. This will happen earlier or later anyway, so I suggest to take the TourBus as a model, where we can design this without much pressure. -- HelmutLeitner
I agree that we are going in cycles. I thought that now - Sunir being back - might be a good time to discuss and advance the ideas and reach a consensus, but seemingly it isn't. So I think I will turn to the extension of the TourBus again. -- hl
[in response to a deleted comment]
I think that the TourBus should not manage pages on other wikis. We just can't (write about their mission or sites). We also can't know what their neighbourhood is, if they don't tell us. I see the TourBus in a passive role.
There will be positive and negative effects on MeatBall. I think it is Sunir's decision, whether or how long the TourBus can stay here. -- HelmutLeitner
At the risk of being a back seat driver, I think the usefulness of a TourBus to new wikizens will be lost should it degenerate into a safari.
Wow - are the tours and all the route maps and such managed through scripts, or manually edited? I see a manual type of deal as being quite ErrorProne?. This is basically a WebRing for Wiki - so why not just allow users to add their own sites by editing the links? Let SoftSecurity to the rest. -- EvanLanglois
Rereading this page, I disagree with Sunir's statement, This should be obvious by the fact that all construction has been done by MeatballWiki participants, in particular the stronger members of this community. I have contacted several wiki founders, who have independently set up the bus tour, although I have helped others with the "set up" as well. -- MarkDilley
Changed route of Bus Nr. 66
I inserted [MacMac] - the Israeli Macintosh Community wiki to the end of the route. I hope the management will like this new addition. If not, you are invited to change the route and edit the next stop in MacMac?. As an Hebrew wiki, MacMac? could be a rather hostile bus stop to most tourists, but isn't the bus system like that? --[Nir Soffer]
Ahh, finally I see a need to ask this body what we should do?
Case 1 - The Multilingual Wikipedia link from the Meatball TourBusStop is just a link to the tour. We are not included in the tour. I made a comment in what I thought was a good place. . .but I might need to rethink that. I think they should include Meatball:TourBusStop on their route.
Case 2 - I just contacted SamBower from the cool GreenmuseumWiki and asked if I can place his wiki on the eclectic wiki tour until another tour is available for it. (Sam Says OK, wherever you want it is fine.)
However both of these cases suggest that some responsible folks connect with our wonderful wikiers and explain to them the idea of the TourBus project.
OR
Let the project develop however it does.
What are other folks thoughts on this? Best, MarkDilley
Well, if either party doesn't respond within a week by 5/22/3, I think I will pull both of them off the TourBusStop. I am asking if the Greenmuseum wiki want to be on the eclectic wiki tour for now, currently it is an off site TourBusStop with no route pointing at the main hub, more properly called a TourBusStopRemoteLocator?. As for the Multilingual Wiki tour, I find it confusing, and I don't think I have made it through yet. Someone needs to map it out, and it seems pretty similar to the Wikipedia tour. -- MarkDilley
The question as I see it is: Do these two links add to the strength of the Meatball TourBusStop? I think as they are now, no, as I have hopefully explained above. But I do not want to force anyone to do anything, I just want to have the most credible page. Currently that is not the case, IMHO. -- MarkDilley
Just joining the discussion now and glad to see GreenmuseumWiki mentioned here. Thanks Mark for introducing me to the TourBus. I'd love to see GreenmuseumWiki on the eclectic wiki tour or anywhere you (or BusManagement) think is appropriate. Just let me know where you want us to camp. We're definitely not a wiki with tons of users since most environmental artists would rather be outdoors but it has some stuff of interest. -- SamBower
MarkDilley did suggest I set up a stop on the bus tour. And I would have, but I never quite understood how it worked or what I needed to do. At the time I didn't have time to try and figure it out. Now I have a bit of time, so is there any sort of TourBusForDummies page to explain very, very simplistically? -- PhilJones
... later ...
I'm starting to get the idea, but it's still very confusing. I wonder about automating the process more. Is there a use for RssFeeds somewhere here? For example, the TourBusMap could make each route available as an RSS feed. In fact, maybe any wiki who wanted to join a tour could send a TrackBack ping to the BusServer?. The BusServer? would then make routes available as feeds. And wikis which want to be on the tour could simply take the route description with themselves slotted in, and use it to generate the next stop. Guess I'm just free-styling now ... :-)
Mark, thanks. I'm extremely busy with a couple of projects this week, but maybe next week I'll have a go. I'll keep you posted of my progress. And ask if I get stuck. - regards, PhilJones.
swiki.net (Wiki:SwikiFarm) seems to have disappeared. Anyone have any news about them? -- JerryMuelver
What about starting a bus tour through educational and university wikis, maybe another through school wikis, kind of more for kids? I don't know if there is enough such wiki yet. It would be useful if I could present a university wiki bus-tour on http://cafoscari.wiki.taoriver.net. 040312 13:35 UTC, +01h -- MattisManzel
Thanks Helmut, I wrote to rusty, let's see. The Tourbus is cool for getting a rough idea of wikilandia.
I hope I'm doing this correctly; I am completely new to wikis, which is why the tourbus seemed like a fine idea to me when I came across it. Alas on route 01, embarking from MeatballWiki, it failed on the second stop with the message "Seedwiki had trouble retrieving your page(page name=TourBusStop and wikiid=1231. If you are returning to a bookmarked URL the wiki may have been deactivated". The wiki itself has clearly not been deactivated (WikiFish), just the link appears to be broken.
(I see i'll have to look up html formatting rules somewhere, but this is a quick drive-by, and they're not available from this page. Apologies; I hope the problem is easy to find as described; if not, feel free to email me and I shall reproduce). -- AlixPiranha
Fab tour. Thanks guys. I had a problem with the link from the hammond organ wiki but maybe it was just me... -- andyc
The bus #42 has a broken route, because UnrealWiki is offline. Maybe just today. Let's see. Is there still no bus driver? --DanielBrü?�?ler 01.11.04
Thank you for your attention.
[Somebody on WikiPedia wrote]: Do tours in North America and UK really have names that are completely hyphenated? and StephenGilbert replied: No, that's just what those crazy tour bus guys over at MeatballWiki called them.
I have to concur, actually. What's the reason for the tours being named as they are? It could be slightly more user-friendly as a system to have names like "International Wiki Tour" instead of "INTERNATIONAL-WIKI-TOUR".
It was also asked on the same page: Why do none of the busses have another bus going the opposite direction? Again, that's a good point. Should we modify the bus stop template to include "Previous stop: ..." and "Next stop: ..."?
I'm aware that should these changes be made it would be a bunch of work updating every stop in the system, but it shouldn't be too bad if each driver takes care of their own route.
Thoughts? -- EarleMartin
Oh, they were just for some context. I'll leave the suggestion here for people to see, and if people don't seem to mind, I might start converting the stops in a week or so. Of course, consistency will be key, but it might take a little while, especially if I'm the only one making the changes and there are wikis I don't have editor logins on. But I'll be happy to do it, nevertheless. -- EarleMartin
I would like to point out that "crazy" is a term of endearment and playful ribbing in my part of the world, and should be taken as such in the above comment. No insult was intended. -- StephenGilbert
I'm a [KayakWiki] contributor. Is it supposed to be be part of the grand tour? Should I remove it? -- HarryWood
OK done, but I notice there's some other wikis (looking on the eclectic tour) which are on the grand tour, and shouldn't be (such as [toothycat], [chicago humanist], and [nomenic]). Maybe the bus drivers could keep a look out for old buses on other routes, which have gone astray. -- HarryWood
OK so it's a link to the main 'bus station', but why is it shown as a bus? I don't really understand the thinking behind that -- HarryWood
Bus 66 is broken again the link from MoinMoin to PersonalTelco fails 404. -- SGBailey
People who come to any site already have pre-existing aspirations and desires. It might be helpful for wikis they visit to be able quickly to identify these aspirations and desires and to facilitate their access more directly and easily to the wikis or parts of the wikis that might be best suited to facilitating the accomplishment of their pre-existing aspirations or desires. The TourBus might be a good instrument toward such an outcome. -- RaviArapurakal?
Thanks, Mark. I should have been more clear. I meant people already have preexisting aspirations and desires, but most of these are so deep-seated, that they aren't consciously aware of them.
This is mainly because today's life compels them to function in a knee-jerk reaction mode. I was wondering if it might make sense for the bus to ensure that the first thing that happens to anyone getting on the bus for the first time, is taken through a socratic dialogic process that draws out from them, for their own cognizance, these deep-seated aspirations and desires.
After visitors to the bus have become clearer about their deeper aspirations and desires, the bus will be much more able to take them where are most likely to get support in the way you suggest. -- RaviArapurakal?
What makes a wiki is us. The growth of the wiki is the result of increasing numbers of us interacting in increasing numbers of ways for increasing periods of time. So the best way to serve the wiki is to make it more useful to more people. The best way to make wikis more useful to more people is to liberate them from their ignorance, their bondage and their inability to fulfill their potential.
Imagine an automated socratic module, that takes each visitor through a series of socratic questions, each of which take the visitor deeper and deeper toward one's own greater aspirations and desires. Imagine the module asking questions about the answers, that take the visitor still deeper into one's own mind, dredging out stuff by having to put it on the screen as responses to the questions. After a while, the module will have facilitated the visitor to a vast number of comments in answers to the questions.
Then imagine the module asking the visitor to prioritize the results in order of importance to her or him. Imagine the visitor then ending up with a prioritized list of things to do in order to fulfill one's own potential. Now imagine she or he posting this list, and wiki members making suggestions on ways towards advancing each of the items on the list. -- RaviArapurakal?
Yes.
Imagine that new visitors are offered a link called GettingReadyToWiki. Moved content there.
Hanos, why don't you take a two-digit route number? Any number free in TourBusMap is fine. Are there any numbers that have a special meaning for Korea? What about 11, 24, 44 or 48, just to make a few suggestions? -- HelmutLeitner
Bus #66 is broken again, I'm afraid. The link from OpenGuideToLondon to the KmWiki has been broken since the KmWiki was moved to its [new location] in WikiSpaces?. I would have updated the link, but the KmWiki no longer has a TourBusStop. Maybe they don't want one anymore and the bus will need to be rerouted? --AnonymousDonor
Fixed by routing Bus 66 to the next stop (WikiPedia:Wikipedia:TourBusStop.) --AnonymousDonor
Why are there leading zeroes ("Bus #01") in bus numbers less then 100? --WolfPeuker
''Probably I'm responsible for this but I can't offer a specific explanation, maybe I thought about a limited space of 99 bus lines and wanted to indicate this range. BTW Many bus stops have stripped the leading zeroes. No negative effects have been observed. :-) -- HelmutLeitner
Let me suggest a new bus line, please, connecting wikis in European languages with rather small communities of speakers, which most usually are not official languages of their respective countries, such as Kornish or Arpitan, or even not confined to a country, such as Romany, or Bavarian, and/or whose speakers are minorities, such as the Sami, or the Sorbian. Last not least some historic or "almost historic" languages, such as Gothic, Manx, old Slavonic, old Greek, Prussian come to mind, and minority languages of European Emigrants outside Europe, such as Plautdietsch, or Pennsylvanian Dutch.
I have no idea as to how much interest there is to individual wikis to be connected by such a bus line. I know of more than two dozen wikipedias that fit in the above collection. Offering them a stop might turn out to be well accepted, or not. As an editor of some of those, I'd like one :-)
When a management decision can be found to at least give it a try, I would volunteer to take some responsibility to build the line, and keep it up. (Is that what a bus driver does? I'm a complete newcomer here.) -- [Purodha]
Nr. 1 is broken at [DaynotesForum:TourBusStop], the next stop is not a link :-(
Help!!!!!How I can create new bus lines?
