Talk:Pixel

For discussions before 2009, see Talk:Pixel/Archive 1

Photosite

Not to get into the merits of Foveon but that article and several others use the term "photosite" which, far as I see, is nowhere defined in Wikipedia. Perhaps this Pixel article would be the best place to define it and explain its relation to the various meanings of "pixel". Jim.henderson (talk) 03:45, 16 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You'd need a sourced definition to start with; it's probably just as ambiguous as "pixel" is. Dicklyon (talk) 04:11, 16 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

For example, if it were sourced, you could use the wiktionary definition, but it disagrees, I think, with some of the uses like in Foveon X3 sensor. Dicklyon (talk) 05:12, 16 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Abbreviation

The term "px" appears to be the abbreviation of the word "pixel." Can we confirm or debunk this?

This section created by 63.226.104.225 and I'm just adding attribution. Looking at the user's talk page, it appears that this user has been a serial adder of unsigned comments and warned about vandalism before. DQweny (talk) 22:14, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The phrase "the smallest item of information in an image"

I have been checking copy-vio problems in the computer graphics article and happen to notice the phrase "the smallest item of information in an image" used there and here, apparently based on the source

Rudolf F. Graf (1999). Modern Dictionary of Electronics. Oxford: Newnes. p. 569. ISBN 0-7506-43315.

Now I was wonder whether or not quotation marks have to be added? Eventually I think not, because this seems to be an exception in Wikipedia:Plagiarism, see here, which states:

Here are some examples where attribution is generally not required:

Use of common expressions and idioms, including those that are common in various sub-cultures such as academic ones. In order to qualify as a "common expression or idiom":
- the phrase must have been used without attribution at least 2 years ago by someone other than the originator and in a reliable source, in other words one that is likely to have watchful editors and lawyers.

The particular phrase is used in at least two other books, see here

Jill Marie Koelling (2004). Digital imaging: a practical approach‎. Rowman Altamira. p.1
Joash Moo (2009). Art in life. Pearson Education South Asia. p.180 ‎

The first source expressed "A bit is the smallest piece of information in an image file", and the second source states: "Pixel : A picture element, which is the smallest piece of information in an image."

I am beginning to get second thoughts here. The second source could be based on Wikipedia, the first source is talking about "bits" and the original source Graf (1999) only mentioned the phrase "The smallest part of information in a binary notation system". I guess this leaves me with the question if Graf (1999) could be considered the source in the first place...!? -- Mdd (talk) 23:31, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, it's an interesting question. The second source you cite is a 2009 source, so you're probably right they got it from wikipedia. And the first is not about pixel per se. GBS will not show me the page with the pixel entry in Graf, so I can't check what he said. Decent definitions for pixel are notoriously difficult to find (at least, I hope I've made this problem notorious via my own paper and talk). Maybe we should look for a couple of alternative definitions to use instead. Dicklyon (talk) 23:41, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I have the same GBS problem. I guess the easiest thing to do here is to find what Graf did say about pixels. I am not sure what paper you refer to. If they are indeed notoriously difficult to find, your last suggestion to search for some alternative one's might not be that easy? -- Mdd (talk) 23:52, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you look at the history, e.g. this edit of mine, it appears that there's no reason to suspect that that phrase came from that source. I think you just moved it there, so you should probably move it back. The guy who cited Graf here said it was just for pixel = picture element. And then here an anon changed both the definition and what the source was attached to; I think it would be best take the lead back to something like what it said before this one. Dicklyon (talk) 23:54, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, this is an interesting turn. I noticed you already made the changes... and removed the phrase. At the moment I think this is a good think to do: Since that phrase isn't based on Graf, my mistake, it could be possible that that phrase is a copy-vio from Koelling (2004). -- Mdd (talk) 00:15, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. I also like this restored definition better "a pixel... is a single point in a raster image". Just plain and simple. -- Mdd (talk) 00:19, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see how the phrase "the smallest piece of information in an image" for pixel could have been taken from "A bit is the smallest piece of information in an image file". Sometimes phrases just happen. "smallest piece of information" is in over 600 books. Dicklyon (talk) 00:28, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mmm... The reason I started this talk item in the first place was, that the specific expression "the smallest piece of information in an image" seemed like a phrase that could be copyrighted. I read somewhere that an expression can start with just three words. But I don't know all ins and outs... one way or on other. I don't think I started this discussion for the wrong reason, and I appreciate your feed back and solution. I already implemented it in the computer graphics article as well. -- Mdd (talk) 00:44, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. The phrase was added here without a source. Regarding the anon's other edits, see here this person does seem to be an expert in the field, and knows what he or she is talking about. -- Mdd (talk) 02:46, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Right, that's one of the diffs I linked. I don't see why you think he's an expert. Dicklyon (talk) 06:42, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, you are right, sorry. The user did make some advanced additions to the article, and his last remark here. However I often have difficulties assissing situations like this. Do you think he is not? -- Mdd (talk) 12:13, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's hard to guess. He seemed to be into the pixel article, and not much else, but not clear why. Dicklyon (talk) 00:40, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! This is "Anon" from 2008, still posting anonymously to protect my employer, and still an expert in the field. Let me reassure you right now that the text I wrote earlier is in no way a copyright violation, it's simply a statement of fact using the language of signal processing: A pixel is indeed the smallest piece of information in an image.

If I may be so bold as to contrast that with a misleading statement: "In digital imaging, a pixel, or pel, (picture element) is a *single point* in a raster image..." (emphasis mine)

(Us in the industry would call that a single sample of a point-sampled image.)

Mr Lyon, if you're still confused on the difference between a "sample" and a "point", please re-read the (somewhat quaint) first reference listed: http://alvyray.com/Memos/CG/Microsoft/6_pixel.pdf

Everybody, repeat it with me now, it feels good: "A pixel is *not* a little square."

First Sentence Confusion

The topic is pixel, and yet the first sentence starts making odd divisions in its useage by stating that it is used in digital devices (only?) and that "raster" differs in comparison to "display devices". It then speaks of smallest screen element, but then one finds that display devices includes tactile devices for the blind. Very confusing.

First, pixels may be used in analog displays, and second, raster is as opposed to vector. Is that not correct? Thanks. - KitchM (talk) 21:24, 7 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Display Screen

I'm not sure how the meaning of "display" in LCD is but I thought it was the noun. Therefor LCD Screen would be wrong, wouldn't it? I'm not a native English speaker but where I come from people tend to say that even stranger, they say "LCD Display". I always thought "LCD" was enough. --80.109.201.185 (talk) 08:49, 27 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

LCD can sometimes be enough, but LCD display or LCD screen is not wrong, just more explicit. Dicklyon (talk) 14:58, 27 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]